Reality Check India

AIIMS Director Sacked

Posted in Uncategorized by realitycheck on July 5, 2006

Thus comes to an end 48 years of illustrious service to AIIMS. The top most cardiac surgeon who has performed the first heart transplant procedure in India has been ousted by a 37-year old minister.

http://www.expressindia.com/fullstory.php?newsid=70483

Like V.K.Malhotra of BJP said today, “This is a black day for the autonomy of all educational institutes”.

The UPA government seems to be helpless and directionless. They really need to check the Dravidian influence on the centre. Like I said in my previous post on the subject, disrespect for scholarship, disrespect for institutions, are all fair game for these politicians. Read here https://realitycheck.wordpress.com/2006/06/17/48-years-of-dedication/

Tamilnadu is an exception when it comes to quotas (see how Kerala was not able to pull off excluding the creamy layer below). Tamilnadu cannot be used as a model for India, quotas have a different meaning there.

Reactions from other famous surgeons.

Dr K M Cherian, CEO, Frontier Lifeline, Chennai: It’s very bad… If he was in a private hospital, he would have made so much money. What did he get by serving the government so long?

Dr Naresh Trehan, Escorts Heart Institute: It’s not good. It’s a no-win situation for anybody

Dr L M Nath, former AIIMS director: A wrong decision where everyone’s a loser. Poor patients are the biggest losers, deprived of the services of a great doctor. Classic example of ego coming in the way of rational decisions

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41 Responses

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  1. XYZ said, on July 5, 2006 at 5:51 pm

    .RC,

    you have given me an opportunity to vent my spleen.Thank you.i have done so in many barely concealed guises.

    you should forget this reservation issue and move on

    it is vp singh,UPA etc that dangle this candy in front of TN.to be fair to DMK etc they themselves were not serious about this.there is respect for iits,AIIMS in TN

    initially they wanted complete domination in TN,but if somebody is offering a piece of cake at the centre,they will be less than human not to take it.

    after the shock treatment at the hands of jaya and a rapidly globalising world,they realise they have to engage india.

    TN has few raw materials and no great industrial base,the only way the dravidian politicians can engage india is through a demand for proportional reservation.

    its politicians do not consider themselves as indians but as dravidians.that is the root issue.

    from their view point,it is a question of identity.

    in kerala muslims and ezhavas have substantial reservation,the polity is fragmented but the christians and muslims are not bold enough to challenge the indian identity.malayalam is more sanskritised and the sambandham relationships have produced the menon,nair,kurup,nambiar castes.

    one has to accept the fragmented nature of indian society inherited from the past.

    it is a fact that the brahminical upper castes have an advantage over others because they have inherited the ancient indo-european literary and intellectual tradition.look at your own command of the english language,the flow of thoughts and the ease with which you express them.the dravidians can never match it.

    though not every brahmana has the same control over the language,it is a fact that one can find very few,if any,obcs with such command of the language.

    the obc’s are at a perpetual disadvantage on this count.

    the iits and AIIMS do not test competence in english,but the tamil dravidians(not the andhra ones) have convinced themselves they cannot compete with the rest on an equal footing.tamil chauvinism has also played a significant part in it.

    states like karnataka and maharashtra which never joined this bandwagon,will now start making regional claims.

    the obc’s of northern india who are making silent but spectacular progress in education can also make similar demands.

    RC,all this is part of MAYA.Great jnanis say so.we need to do our duty and move on.

    even in ancient times vibhishana helped Sri Rama.of cours,we live in different times.there are good persons in TN.ours is a diverse society.

    modern life is so complex.education is only a small part.there are so many ingredients.literary education is different from scientific and technical education.Money is a big driving factor.

    india is a big country.it should find its way.if not it is the Karma of her people.

    thank you again for giving me an opportunity

  2. XYZ said, on July 5, 2006 at 6:35 pm

    RC,
    thank you very much for giving me an opportunity to vent my spleen.

    i can understand your frustration at the treatment meted out to Dr.venugopal,but you should forget this reservation issue and move on

    it is vp singh,UPA etc that dangle this candy in front of TN.to be fair to DMK etc they themselves were not serious about this.there is respect for iits,AIIMS in TN

    initially they wanted complete domination in TN,but if somebody is offering a piece of cake at the centre,they will be less than human not to take it.

    after the shock treatment at the hands of jaya and a rapidly globalising world,they realise they have to engage india.

    TN has few raw materials and no great industrial base,the only way the dravidian politicians can engage india is through a demand for proportional reservation.

    its politicians do not consider themselves as indians but as dravidians.that is the root issue.

    from their view point,it is a question of identity.

    in kerala muslims and ezhavas have substantial reservation,the polity is fragmented but the christians and muslims are not bold enough to challenge the indian identity.malayalam is more sanskritised and the sambandham relationships have produced the menon,nair,kurup,nambiar castes.

    one has to accept the fragmented nature of indian society inherited from the past.

    it is a fact that the brahminical upper castes have an advantage over others because they have inherited the ancient indo-european literary and intellectual tradition.look at your own command of the english language,the flow of thoughts and the ease with which you express them.the dravidians can never match it.

    though not every brahmana has the same control over the language,it is a fact that one can find very few,if any,obcs with such command of the language.

    the obc’s are at a perpetual disadvantage on this count.

    the iits and AIIMS do not test competence in english,but the tamil dravidians(not the andhra ones) have convinced themselves they cannot compete with the rest on an equal footing.tamil chauvinism has also played a significant part in it.

    states like karnataka and maharashtra which never joined this bandwagon,will now start making regional claims.

    the obc’s of northern india who are making silent but spectacular progress in education can also make similar demands.

    RC,all this is part of MAYA.Great jnanis say so.we need to do our duty and move on.

    even in ancient times vibhishana helped Sri Rama.of cours,we live in different times.there are good persons in TN.ours is a diverse society.

    modern life is so complex.education is only a small part.there are so many ingredients.literary education is different from scientific and technical education.Money is a big driving factor.

    india is a big country.it should find its way.if not it is the Karma of her people.

  3. Bruno said, on July 6, 2006 at 12:03 am

    The issue is very simple

    1. Few doctors did not work for some days
    2. The Minister said no pay for no work (And he did not initiate any punitive action like transfer, depromotion etc)
    3. Venugopal said, If you don’t give them pay, I will resign

    I want to know (from all who support venugopal) as to whether you can ask for pay when you do not do any work

  4. Bruno said, on July 6, 2006 at 12:05 am

    // TN has few raw materials and no great industrial base,the only way the dravidian politicians can engage india is through a demand for proportional reservation.//

    And inspite of that, The state is leading the nation (and second to kerala and Union territories) in many fields like health, education, low crime rates, economy etc

  5. Bruno said, on July 6, 2006 at 12:06 am

    // TN has few raw materials and no great industrial base,the only way the dravidian politicians can engage india is through a demand for proportional reservation.//

    Possessing the fifth largest economy (2004-2005) among states in India, Tamil Nadu is also the second most industrialised state next to Maharastra.[3] It ranks second in per capita income (2004-2005) among large states. It ranks third in foreign direct investment approvals (cumulative 1991-2002) of Rs.225,826 million ($5,000 million), next only to Maharashtra (Rs.366,024 million ($8,100 million)) and Delhi (Rs.303,038 million ($6,700 million). The State’s investment constitutes 9.12% of the total FDI in the country.[4] Unlike many other states, the economic resources are quite spread out, rather than concentrated in a small industrialised area.

    According to the 2001 Census, Tamil Nadu has the highest level of urbanization (43.86%) in India, accounting for 6% of India’s total population and 9.6% of the urban population. Tamil Nadu has a network of about 110 industrial parks and estates offering developed plots with supporting infrastructure.

  6. Confused said, on July 6, 2006 at 12:27 am

    Bruno,

    Stop obfuscating the issue.

    First, Venugopalan has not resigned. He has been fired.

    Second, the the government had assured before the SC that they will not take any punitive action against the striking doctors. Even SC has pointed that out, without SC intervention, the strike might have continued till now.

    Third, the government has done what it could do. a) Withhold salaries b)treat the strike period as a break in service.

    You cannot ”depromote” or transfer a resident doctor.

  7. realitycheck said, on July 6, 2006 at 3:36 am

    The real measure of Tamilnadu is the nations lowest status of Dalits.

    Like merit, industrialization does not have a direct relationship with the quota system, only social justice has a direct relationship with it. It was meant to be that way.

    I am sure TN industries will not be affected if all OBCs are reclassified as FC. Do you want to do that ?

  8. realitycheck said, on July 6, 2006 at 3:51 am

    XYZ,

    >> you should forget this reservation issue and move on >>

    The reason I started this blog was to protest two issues that I thought were going to lay this country to waste.

    1. The OBC quotas. What was intended only for SC/STs have been hijacked by this enormous group. OBCs are neither fish nor fowl. There is no check on where and how far this “backward” card can be played. There is no requirement or availability of any type of data to establish backwardness.

    2. The naxalite movement. I wrote about 3-4 posts about it. It would shock anyone to know that the Indian state does not control 25% of its heartland. Shocking events like the hijacking of two tourist boats in Nagarjunasagar was not even reported in the media.

    Today though the OBC issue is burning, how this plays out will be a landmark in our history.

    The media (although it is much better today) still wants only to talk about silly page-3 issues. YOu can almost sense the relief when anchors on NDTV move on from AIIMS story to “party kissing controversy”.

    Whenever I come across any information pertaining to these two issues, I will highlight in this blog.

  9. Confused said, on July 6, 2006 at 4:50 am

    RC,

    Plase go on. There are people like me who aread you regularly.

  10. ABC said, on July 6, 2006 at 8:46 am

    “The real measure of Tamilnadu is the nations lowest status of Dalits.”

    Do you have anything more than your word to substantiate that?

  11. realitycheck said, on July 6, 2006 at 9:36 am

    Hi ABC,

    This is what Chandrabhan Prasad the noted Dalit scholar has to say.

    Out of every hundred SCs in UP, 43 are cultivators, whereas in Tamil Nadu it is 15, Kerala 3, Karnataka 23, and Andhra Pradesh 13.

    While at the all-India level, out of every hundred SCs, 49 are landless agricultural labourers, in Tamil Nadu, it is 64. IN other words the primary job of 64% of SCs are just working on the lands of OBC farmers.

    There is almost no Dalit political voice worth mentioning in TN. The leading Dalit party DPI was offered *2* seats by the DMK while their populaton is 30% of Tamilnadu.

    Contrast that with the BSP (a dalit party of UP) which has *19* MPs in the lok sabha.

    Read more here:
    http://www.ambedkar.org/chandrabhan/interview.htm

  12. ABC said, on July 6, 2006 at 2:29 pm

    “There is almost no Dalit political voice worth mentioning in TN. The leading Dalit party DPI was offered *2* seats by the DMK while their populaton is 30% of Tamilnadu.”

    Tell this to Kamal Hassan who had to face these guys before the release of Sandiyar,sorry Virumandi. Personally I thought he deserved it. Point I am trying to make is that representation in the constituent assembly is not the only measure of social mobility-case in point-the Konars- they have “come under the ADMK umbrella”.This despite the efforts of a well-know ex-Indian Bank Chairman’s efforts to mobilise them.

    Agreed, Dalits have a long way to go in TN-but lets not shoot the dravidian just yet.

    Have started noticing this anti-TN streak in you recently. Definitely not helping your case with a few OBC’s like me who are anti-reservation.

  13. ABC said, on July 6, 2006 at 2:32 pm

    Sorry I meant legistlative assembly… :))

  14. realitycheck said, on July 6, 2006 at 4:24 pm

    ABC,

    Thanks for your comments.

    I am not anti-TN at all. I think the true potential of Tamilians have been locked down by divisive politics.

    There is a strong case being made by a lot of politicians that TN is a model state as far as OBC quotas go. A lot of my posts are targeted at that.

    You may be right about communities representated within larger parties. In todays divided society, I wonder how much they can achieve without a political pressure group that works exclusively for their interests (like the PMK, Muslim MK, etc).

  15. Ramanan said, on July 6, 2006 at 4:55 pm

    ABC: “Have started noticing this anti-TN streak in you recently. Definitely not helping your case with a few OBC’s like me who are anti-reservation.”

    This statement reeks of arrogance – “I am part of the powerful OBC section, so be careful about offending me..” I think TN OBCs (especially the FCs classified as OBCs) need to reflect on what kind of state TN really is – both from a political and social standpoint. TN today is really the biggest apartheid state in India, with OBCs presiding over all aspects of the state and lording it over everybody else – dalits, FCs etc.

  16. realitycheck said, on July 6, 2006 at 5:53 pm

    Ramanan,

    Perhaps you are being too hard on ABC. I need this kind of feedback, it is very important to put across ones viewpoint without working up emotions. That is quite a fine line to walk, but a very important one.

    Regarding your point about the FCs classified as OBCs of TN. You have a very valid point. You would expect them to lead the change. There are so many brilliant and accomplished people from those communities (FC-OBC) who do not support this type of action (of the health minister). Unfortunately they cant speak up very loudly because they are seen as having eaten the fuits of this system. Even if they make it on merit (which a large number of FC-OBCs do), they feel indebted to the system.

  17. XYZ said, on July 6, 2006 at 6:01 pm

    ABC,

    i felt ashamed when i saw your comments .

    could only think of the kural ‘yahakkayanum naa kaaka…’

    your language made me eat my words.

    i was intemperate.undoubtedly it was an expression of feelings of my own inadequacy.

    neverthless some of the remarks, i believe go to the root of the problem.

    many obc’s have no literary,intellectual or spiritual traditions(other than brahmanical) to support them.

    in older times they were guided by brahmanas,but then they did not face competition with brahmanas.

    the real backwards had no social mobility.their exposure was limited to puranic hinduism.

    on the other hand islam and christianity offer ,atleast theoretically,a world view,based on equality.

    the dravidian obc’s,having to compete with brahmanas,have no social and intellectual ideologies to fall back on.

    the situation we are facing is extremely new.the tamil writer maalan calls it ‘pala yugangalin sangamam'(confluence of many ages)

    tamil society itself was divided from ancient times.though not on lines of classical division of manu.vellalas and maravas were the dominant communities.in later times nayaks,chettiars completed the hierarchy.

    the dravidian nationalists built a hollow edifice on anti brahminism.their claims of equality were equally hollow not based on historical experience.educated brahmanas driven by indian nationalism had contempt for the dravidian leaders who were backed by the british.

    the only thing positive about it was the revival of tamil language.

    but the line it took was tamil nationalism while being blind to the possibilities of indian nationalism.

    in maharashtra and West Bengal,social reform and hindu renaissance had paved the way for social cohesion.

    unfortunately,tamil chauvinism has obscured the fact,that there are other languages and literatures rich in their own way.
    brahmanas were a soft target.the instinct of self preservation made them oblivious of the idea of india.

    things are changing.but yet they dont want to change the habits of mind.

    this problem is faced to a greater or lesser extent by obc’s throughout india.

    obc’s in northern india are escaping this situation by increasing literacy and the widespread of hindi.

    neverthless many obc’s are culturally insecure,they fall back on chauvinism and group mentality.

    this is found even in maharashtra .eg;chaggan bhujbal,narayan rane

    but with empowerment,literacy,adult franchise there is an opportunity for all the languages to flourish.

    the old caste system has lost all relevance.the brahmanas have been the first to secularize.their intellectual tradition has played a big part in adopting and adapting to western ways.

    nobody denies the need for inclusiveness.in TN,being a brahmana is a definite disadvantage.in other states their advantages are being fast neutralised.

    yet karunanidhi and others are still demonising brahmanas.they are blind to the existence of the creamy layer among “obcs”

    more importantly they have no vision for india.historically iits arose out of that vision for india.the iitians are worthy of respect because they showcased the ideals of the modern age.that india can take its place in the comity of nations.

    the obcs have fair opportunities.they need to take their place in modern india shaped by world events.they cannot reteat to hollow slogans.they cannot rely on false dogmas.there will be no brahmanas to guide them.they have to think and work alongside brahmanas ,other fcs and scs to grab the moment.

    that is why i feel this debate is becoming pointless.one large powerful group which is used to a certain way of life,does not seem to realise that this is a unique moment in history ,where we all have to be open minded.

    there is abundant talent in all groups,but the clarity and forethought of brahmanas seems to be almost absent in other groups.(paarpan)

    i feel the obcs are still clinging to their old ways.

    personally i am half baked and dumb.

    the clever guys good in mathematics,physics or something else will find their way.

    but is there any hope of building a truly just and fair society.which also recogonises merit.

    we accept there are differences between individuals.but equal opportunities for all should be our aim.

    high positions should be on merit.

    but there is no consensus on this.

    i feel i have exhausted myself on this issue.

    my advice to RC totally unwarranted.he is doing something very important.

    thank you.

  18. barbarindian said, on July 6, 2006 at 6:36 pm

    The economy of TN being one of the best is a very lame argument for reservations. One could say that the brilliant TamBrams including Murthy etc. have contributed the most to the economy.

    You have to understand the economy of TN also owes to large transfers to the state in the form of bribes to the DMK government so that they don’t collapse the weak coalition govt. at the center.

    I don’t see how we can avoid sounding casteist and communalist in the current state of affairs. TN population is perhaps 8 crores. To expect the whole of India (100+ crores) to give up a large part of the pie to dravidians to whom they had no geographic or historic link is rather ambitious.

  19. realitycheck said, on July 7, 2006 at 3:29 am

    Barb,

    You are absolutely right. It is almost impossible not be be casteist today. This is because there is no check on where and how the OBC card can be played. It gets worse because the OBC tag is not related to economic or social backwardness based on data. It has come to mean, “politically powerful class”.

    Anyone it seems can just walk up play the OBC card and cut the line. Since the SC/ST card is linked to social stigmas such as untouchability, unclean work, and bonded labour – we have come to accept it as part of our lives.

    The industrial condition of any state has nothing to do with OBC quota system. The real measure can only be social indicators such as who is benefiting, which OBC components are reaping the benefits, who is left behind, what is the impact on the open competition, and continuous monitoring of social-economic status of all the OBC beneficiary castes. Whether the FC-OBCs like it or not, we must push for *social data*, not industrial output or pollution levels or forest cover.

    You cant check for fever by measuring blood pressure.

  20. OBC said, on July 7, 2006 at 3:46 pm

    let’s make moolah.there is an economic boom on.we are rich and powerful.we are the MAJORITY.no one can stop us.we are having a laaaaaaaaat of FUN!be a smart(chamattu) boy.not an asattu br…

    we are allowing CTS,TCS and Infosys in our state.

    if you are very clever,go abroad and work in MNCs

    or do research in Tifr or BARC.

    or go to princeton,MIT or Berkeley

    you cannot stop us.

  21. OBC said, on July 7, 2006 at 4:14 pm

    ABC,

    do you really belong to the OBC?

  22. Barbarindian said, on July 8, 2006 at 1:49 am

    you cannot stop us.

    No need for us to stop you. You will soon drown in an alphabet soup starting with MBC. Already happened in Bihar by the way.

    In the end you will discover there is no you and me.

  23. Ramanan said, on July 8, 2006 at 4:57 am

    Barbarindian,

    Interesting.. the MBC-OBC divide (or more generally quota within a quota) happened much quicker in the North. Wondering if the Dravidian movement managed to keep the lid on that one for this long in TN..

  24. kallan said, on July 8, 2006 at 2:00 pm

    equality is an illusion.india is a fuzzy idea.these have been around for 50 years.

    we have been tamils from the dawn of civilization.we are tamils.tamil is the the very breath of our life.you have tamil on your lips.we have tamizh in our blood.

    we are the custodians of the land and the language.we gave YOU protection.

    accept the TRUTH.

  25. karl marx said, on July 8, 2006 at 2:12 pm

    the obcs are the life blood of the productive forces of india.reservation for obcs will give them their rightful place in indian society.it will unleash their productive and creative capacity.they will manage better the interplay betwee the forces of capital,land and labor.

  26. ramadoss said, on July 8, 2006 at 2:14 pm

    the central institutions should reflect the ethnic composition of indian society.

  27. realitycheck said, on July 8, 2006 at 2:18 pm

    >> the obcs are the life blood of the productive forces of india.reservation for obcs >>

    Then let us call it the “Life blood of productive forces” quota.

    If you want to call it “OBC” quota, the members of the group must be classified based on recent socio-economic data.

  28. murasoli said, on July 8, 2006 at 2:22 pm

    those who comment in this blog do not know the pulse of the people of tamizhnadu.they do not understand the emotions and aspirations of the tamizh people.Read dinakaran.others are more tamizh nationalist than us.

  29. realitycheck said, on July 8, 2006 at 2:28 pm

    >> we have been tamils from the dawn of civilization >>

    Good idea.

    Maybe we should call it the “people-who-were-here-first-quota”.

    Naickers, Reddiars, Chettiars, Saurashtrans, Naidus, all Muslims from Nizams land, all Vellore-Arcot muslims, Vishwakarmas, came to TN much after brahmins, so what are you going to do about that ?

    If you want to still call it the OBC quota, the government must study socio-economic data to establish backwardness.

    Why are you posting under different names ?

  30. murali said, on July 8, 2006 at 2:29 pm

    loved it.

  31. Ramanan said, on July 8, 2006 at 5:32 pm

    Quotas in TN is different from quotas in the rest of India. In TN, it’s an open secret that quotas are for the “right people”. The “wrong people” are excluded. The “right people” are defined by half-assed racial theories that have no basis in fact, which only the Dravidian leadership believes in now. TN quotas are very similar to Malaysian quotas for “Bhumiputras”. Similar to Malaysia, TN has a very divided society where animosity between the “anointed” and the “non-anointed” is right below the surface.

  32. realitycheck said, on July 9, 2006 at 4:57 am

    >>TN quotas are very similar to Malaysian quotas for “Bhumiputras”. >>

    You will be surprised that many politicians are actually using this analogy. One of them said that “look how advanced malaysia is compared to India, so lets adopt the bumiputera system”.

    The problem is, it is fairly cut-and-dry that Chinese and Indians came to Malaysia fairly recently. So, atleast the identification and historical basis is valid. We cant say anything like that about OBCs.

    The real reason for these bogus comparisons is to avoid studying or evaluating each OBC component for backwardness or the progress made by them over the past 60-80 years (four generations).

  33. Bruno said, on July 10, 2006 at 6:19 pm

    One gentleman said that he is ready to resign if pay was cut for those who did not do any work.

    But he did not sent his resignation letter.

    WHen he has been fired he goes to court

    This proves that HIS EARLIER STATEMENT THAT HE IS READY TO RESIGN is a big big lie

    WHat a shame ???

    WHy did he earlier LIE that he is ready to resign

    SUch double tongued fanatics are better removed from the system soon

  34. Bruno said, on July 10, 2006 at 6:24 pm

    Venugopal as director did not treat patients. (NO director does surgeries)

    Hence arguments that patients are going to loose are clear indications of helplessness and idiotic behaviour

  35. Bruno said, on July 10, 2006 at 6:26 pm

    I want to know (from all who support venugopal) as to whether you can ask for pay when you do not do any work

  36. Ramanan said, on July 10, 2006 at 7:43 pm

    When I said TN quotas are similar to Malaysian quotas I meant from the so-called “racial intent” point of view. I feel that the Malaysian quotas are quite bogus as well, and have limited the country’s growth .. whatever growth Malaysia has seen is in spite of the internal divisions and racial quotas.

  37. realitycheck said, on July 11, 2006 at 2:20 am

    >>I want to know (from all who support venugopal) as tgoto whether you can ask for pay when you do not do any work >>

    The negotiated settlement was that no action would be taken of any kind against the striking doctors. The government went back on its part of the deal and the courts have rightfully come down hard on it.

    I heard Karunanidhi never attended a single day of TN assembly for the entire 5 year Jaya rule. Do you want to apply the no-work-no-pay rule to him ?

  38. Bruno said, on July 26, 2006 at 3:25 pm

    Why are you against Kalaignar ???

  39. Bruno said, on July 26, 2006 at 3:26 pm

    Why can’t you give the example of Advani (has he attended ALL days in Lok Sabha)… Why only one leader

    Even JJ did not attend the 2006 Budjet.

  40. venkat67 said, on July 27, 2006 at 6:48 am

    Karu did not attend a single day in 5 years!

  41. realitycheck said, on July 27, 2006 at 10:53 am

    // Why are you against Kalaignar ??? Even JJ did not attend the 2006 Budjet. //

    Ok JJ is no angel herself. I dont care about her party either.

    Whether or not doctors have a right to strike is debatable. The main issue in this case is the government pledged in court that no punitive action will be taken if the strike is called off.

    If you give your word you have to respect it.

    If the strikes had not happened, there is absolutely no way the government would have expanded the total number of seats. This is because the whole exercise is motivated and not guided by either social justice to the truly backward or to the concept of equality.


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