Reality Check India

Ram Sethu for dummies

Posted in Uncategorized by realitycheck on September 14, 2007

Update: It seems like no scientific archeological study was ever done in the area. How bizarre ?

——————————–

Some people who read my previous article raised some basic questions about the project.

As a person who is deeply familiar with the geography of the Rameswaram island and its surroundings – let me attempt to answer some basic questions. I have provided links for more advanced references.

Q 1. Is the Ram Sethu an underwater bridge connecting India and Sri Lanka ?

Yes. It connects to Sri Lanka at a place called Talaimannar (not Jaffna – Yazhpaanam) The bridge is to the north of the port of Tuticorin. This means large ships between Chennai and Tuticorin (within the same state of TN) have to circumnavigate Sri Lanka. Small ships have no problem, see below.

Q 2. Is the Ram Sethu unbroken ? Is there no gap, say in between where we can dredge ?

No, there is no gap. Remember, you can only dredge in Indian territorial waters.

Q 3. Arent you being crazy, Mr Reality Check ? You say you support the Sethusamudram project, you also say the bridge must not be touched, you also say no natural gaps exist in the bridge. How is it possible ?

First, a geography lesson.

The Indian mainland ends at a place called Mandapam on the rocky waters of the Palk Strait. Proceeding in a south easterly direction over the Palk Strait for 2.5 kilometers you will reach the island of Rameswaram famous for its Ramanathaswamy temple. The 2.5 km Palk Strait is bridged by both rail and road via the Pamban bridge. This bridge already has a span in it that allows limited ships of moderate draft to pass through.

Once inside Rameswaram island you can proceed further in a south easterly direction for about 30 kms over a sandy causeway to a place called Danushkodi. The name Danushkodi refers to Rama’s bow. It was from here that Rama’s army constructed the bridge to Talaimannar according to Hindu faith. 

The Ram Sethu bridge starts immediately from the head-end of Danushkodi and until it terminates at the other end in Talaimannar, it is unbroken in its entire stretch for the next 48 kms.  There are no natural gaps which can be taken advantage of.

srs3.jpg

So, the Ram Sethu is not from India to Talaimannar, but from Danushkodi to Talaimannar. You can build the Sethusamudram canal without touching the Ram Sethu via the Palk Strait route (see blue line in the map above).

There are other very serious objections to the proposed alignment via the Ram Sethu. They range from economics (toll cost of navigating channel vs circumnavigating SL), logistics (international vessels will anyway take a wide sweep around SL on the high seas), tonnage (large vessels such as oil tankers cannot pass), maintenance (shifting sand banks will threaten any canal). The most important being the ecological impact, the millions of cubic metres of dredged sand and broken coral will have to be dumped in Indian territorial waters only. These will seriously threaten the rich fishing industry in that belt.

I lack further expertise in that area, but here is a rich collection of links for further reading.

1. Presentation about the Sethu project in its current form.

2. Geological questions (megalithic portal UK)

3. The most comprehensive and rational articles on the subject.

Update

Some people have complained that this post is too simplistic. That is probably just because it is for “dummies”. The alternate route suggested here may have ecological problems. If you are asking these deeper questions, then I am happy, this post has worked !

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76 Responses

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  1. INI Signal - » How (not) to write FAQ said, on September 14, 2007 at 11:42 am

    [...] That is NASA denying interpretation of a photo as not theirs is proof positive that the interpretation is wrong. And since when have we started admitting assertions or otherwise by a foreign body as evidence in our courts? And ofcourse, Outlook being Outlook, does not fail to take condescending ad hominem potshots at Advani and the saffron brigade. While we are at this, here is a better FAQ. [...]

  2. ஜயராமன் said, on September 14, 2007 at 11:58 am

    Thanks for this informative article.

    The Ram Sethu is saved. The government has now totally surrendered!

    Jai sri ram

  3. [...] Check has an interesting FAQ on the entire controversy. Q 1. Is the Ram Sethu an underwater bridge connecting India and Sri Lanka [...]

  4. The Acorn » Regarding Sethusamudram said, on September 15, 2007 at 2:41 am

    [...] Posts: Ram Setu for dummies, via Reality Check; On the controversy it has dug up: Jaffna over at the Cynical Nerd’s blog; [...]

  5. dodo said, on September 15, 2007 at 8:48 am

    Very informative! It really helped me by providing an objective ,factual perspective in a brief manner. Thanks again.

  6. [...] Reality Check has an interesting FAQ on the entire controversy. [...]

  7. Retributions » The Absurdiy That is India said, on September 15, 2007 at 5:07 pm

    [...] by religion. The debate on sethusamudram is by no means settled. As Reality Check points out in this informative post, there are serious concerns–both about its economic viability as well as its effect on the [...]

  8. [...] they read RealityCheck? In a major development, the Centre on Friday informed the Supreme Court that it would consider [...]

  9. indian said, on September 16, 2007 at 11:38 pm

    The dredging of the canal will continue. It is for India’s best. It will help India, especially south India, improve its economic strength in relationship to the entire world. It is unfortunate that the Archaelogical Society produced a paper that caused so much rioting and mishap.

    • Dhruv said, on March 29, 2012 at 12:23 pm

      Yes you will improvde economic strength. But one fine tsunami and other other ecological riskes will engulf all your developments.

  10. ranjeet rain said, on September 17, 2007 at 2:51 pm

    Very informative! Please keep posting.

  11. Barbarindian said, on September 17, 2007 at 10:26 pm

    RC,

    You have been called Hindu Fundamentalist on a well known liberal blog.

    Welcome to the club!

  12. realitycheck said, on September 18, 2007 at 3:42 am

    Barb,

    Which one ?

  13. realitycheck said, on September 18, 2007 at 4:00 am

    Barb, I found it !

    In short ,

    Where science and statistics rule – we want life stories instead.

    Where life stories rule – we want science

    I am waiting for a blog post exposing how It would be scientifically impossible for a monkey carrying a mountain to generate enough lift to become airborne.

    This is the stuff 5th standard kids are made of. I believe the blogosphere has moved beyond that.

  14. Gaurav said, on September 18, 2007 at 7:43 am

    Dear RC,

    Welcome to the Dark Side :-). Now feel divine love of Jagadguru.

  15. shashank said, on September 18, 2007 at 1:04 pm

    ram setu should be saved this is the question of faith. but unfortunatly the political party who came in power owing the name of ram, that made the project to break the ram setu is shameful.

  16. realitycheck said, on September 18, 2007 at 1:24 pm

    Shashank,

    There were several alternate alignments being considered by the NDA.
    This is the one that cuts right through the Ram Sethu.

    Debate the project scientifically by all means. Do not debate Ram, the characters in the Ramayana, or the events in the text.

    We Indians need to think big,

    Why not cut right through the mainland using a system of locks behind the Mandapam peninsula ?

    Why not cut through Danushkodi causeway behind the Ram Sethu ? Then we can build a bridge over the cut to reconnect the lost township of Danushkodi.

  17. Observer said, on September 19, 2007 at 2:12 am

    I think it is well known in DMK circles that insiders close to Karunanidhi and TR Baalu stand to benefit from dredging contracts. Maybe money has already exchanged hands, hence the unseemly haste. Of course it also gives that man a chance to poke fun at Hindu mythology. Why do they take votes from Hindus if they dislike them so much? He has now circulated an ordinance providing exclusive reservation for Muslims and Christians. While the likes of Dr. Bruno would be thrilled, this has upset some communities like the Thevars and Gounders, who are now planning a state-wide agitation. They have suggested he can deduct the 7% from the MBC quota since the Vaniars anyway dominate that sub-quota. I think DMK may face a lot of problem in the future because of the legacy of divisiveness and corruption by this man. Here is the link:

    http://www.chennaionline.com/colnews/newsitem.asp?NEWSID={C0F9FB51-2BC0-47B5-B45B-DEC8FA08E0D6}&CATEGORYNAME=TAMNA


    BCs to challenge the ordinance
    Search for More News

    Coimbatore, Sept 18: The Kongu Velala Goundergal Peravai (an association of Backward Community) today said it would challenge the Government ordinance providing reservation for Muslims and Christians, in the appropriate court.

    The ordinance is taking away seven per cent from the 30 per cent already reserved for Backward Community, which formed 60 per cent of the population of Tamil Nadu, Kongu M Loganathan, the district secretary of the association told reporters here.

    Accusing DMK and its Chief Minister M Karunanidhi of reducing the percentage of reservation to BCs whenever it was in power, he said the 50 per cent reservation enjoyed by BCs were brought to down 30 per cent, by giving 20 per cent to Mos Backward Community (MBC).

    Since the BCs, with 141 different communities, would be entitled only for 23 per cent, the Government could take the seven per cent from the 20 per cent reserved for MBC, which wa dominated by Vanniyars, he said.

    The association would also discuss the issue with the representatives of all other BCs to chalk out a strategy, including a State-wide agitation against the ordinance, which deprived the BCs their benefits and rights, Loganathan said.

    It was not understood on what basis the reservation was provided, since there was no exact data of the population including the Muslms and Christians in the State, as recommend ed by Justice Janarthanam Commission, he said. (Agencies)

  18. Observer said, on September 19, 2007 at 2:28 am

    When it comes to religious figures like Mohammed and Jesus, there is some proof they lived. Hinduism being much more ancient may not have much proof beyond some allegories contained in the mythological texts. But the lack of archaeological evidence does not mean such a person never existed. After all, Dwaraka was also supposed to be a myth until archaeological evidence was unearthed.

    However, it is really beside the point to question the details of how Allah appeared to Mohammed in his visions, and the nature of those hallucinations, and whether the stone at the Kaabah was really blessed by him based on collecting his DNA evidence. Nor can we delve too deep into how the “virgin” Mary got pregnant and gave birth to Jesus, or how the Red Sea was parted by the patriarch of the Jews, or whether a place called Eden existed and a couple called Adam and Eve really ate an apple provided by a snake etc. I think the spiritual figures or mythological figures serve as vehicles to reinforce a set of principles and beliefs that appeal to a group of people, and performing a scientific analysis misses the point there.

    • Mallika said, on January 8, 2013 at 6:12 pm

      I really am curious to know what archeological evidences are there for Jesus and Mohammed, for that matter even Buddha. I am not talking of sculptures here. Real evidences like DNA, handwriting, or anything like that that prices beyond doubt. In some research journals it’s said that the face of Buddha is a Greek art inspiration- the way hai is curled etc. Buddha was just before chanakya. And shortly after came Adi Shankara. Though there is argument on Adi Shankara too, there are literary evidences that end with his signature- so we can assume that this is concrete enough. Please answer – I am very eager to know. Thank you

  19. realitycheck said, on September 19, 2007 at 8:08 am

    Observer,

    The constitutional issues with the new 7% reservation are mind boggling. The CM openly said that this was a “poll promise” which was being fulfilled. This is exactly what the lawyers are arguing in the supreme court (that quotas work on a quid-pro-quo basis in exchange for votes).

    It is inconcievable that Christians are educationally backward, being in control of educational institutions at all levels.

    As far as muslims are concerned, the Sachar report itself has claimed that this community has a much higher literacy rate than the state average and upto 20% higher than the SCs.

    So where is the basis for this ? Socially, these two communities do not have castes (or so they claim with respect to Hinduism).

    Data is not just for benefits, but more importantly a way to distribute those benefits.

    Prudent men will anticipate the destructive nature of these divisive policies and act now.

  20. Kumar said, on September 19, 2007 at 2:33 pm

    Check this site, it’s pretty comprehensive on this issue.
    Bridge of Ram

  21. [...] I read through the numerous posts written on this issue, I am stuck mostly by the comments that follow – case in point the latest at the Desi [...]

  22. Ashwametha yaga's horse said, on September 21, 2007 at 6:27 am

    This sort of “natural mounts connecting an island with the near by land” can be seen in many places around the world… Little wonder who built them .. For a start, see Australia and Papua New Guinea

    Few questions
    1. Did The same Rama built the under water bridges all over the world (at least 55 are there is the same images published by NASA)
    2. Why is that no one made any noise before this project started
    3. Armies of Rama defeated Armies of Ravana. Can you ask Srilanka to be a part of India Today as they were defeated by us

  23. realitycheck said, on September 21, 2007 at 6:40 am

    It is a matter of faith. Hindus have faith in this natural mound and not the mound in Papua New Guinea. This is the same way that hindus revere Manasarovar and not the Se La lake. Revere Mt Kailash, but not Mt Everest, even though Mt Everest can kick Mt Kailash’s butt to the atheist. Lets leave it at that.

    I have little doubt that this project can only happen if the Hindu majority can be taken into confidence. You cannot bad mouth their beliefs and use foul language. Even a legitimate project will acquire a sinister image in that environment.

  24. realitycheck said, on September 21, 2007 at 7:12 am

    Add to the previous –

    This is the same as ordinary Tamils (non party workers) of all castes who revere the Kartigai deepam in Tiruvannamalai but dont revere the halogen lamp on the Chennai street corner.

  25. Ashwametha yaga's horse said, on September 21, 2007 at 7:49 am

    So, you do accept that this is a natural mount. That is sensible. Great.

    Questions are still unanswered

    More questions
    Was this spot worshipped before this controversy ??
    How many pujas were so far conducted in this bridge

    no one is trying to damage the shore temples of mahabalipuram or the caves paintings of sithanavasal which are different. This is a “mounts of sand” which was never cared till date

    there was no issue about this till date. the only concern was environment. but suddenly to prevent economic development of tamil nadu and to help srilanka this issue about the “natural mound” has been raked up

  26. Ashwametha yaga's horse said, on September 21, 2007 at 3:03 pm

    I heard that it is given that Rama wanted the bridge to be destroyed after the lanka battle so that lanka is free from intrusion

    why are certain devotees of rama against his wish

  27. phreak said, on September 21, 2007 at 3:20 pm

    a simple question and a conclusion

    Hanuman blew up in size to bring an entire mountain because he didn the exact herb on that mountain.

    then he flew to himalay from sri lanka and back.

    Question:

    couldnt he blow up in size and take ram and his army , so there would have been no need to build the setu at all

    Conclusion:

    the ramayan may be true , but not all that is wrtten is true. many things are exaggerated over the centuries.

    constructing the bandra worli seaface has taken more than 3 years. how can the setu have been built in 5 days?? this is something even retards will understand, but not some humans

  28. Gaurav said, on September 21, 2007 at 4:30 pm

    Phreak,

    Your scientific acumen is astounding.

  29. Gapal Das said, on September 21, 2007 at 7:24 pm

    Science can only been able to unravel less than 1% of world’s mysteries. To this the brightest scientists agree. Belief and that too in these Mega numbers has to be given weight. Its not just about the Ram Sethu, its the way in which Hindus are treated in their own motherland that is appalling. For instance, look at the recent affidavit submitted to the supreme court by the GOI. Such insensitive rubbish. This has been followed by outright outrageous blasphemy. No one can tolerate such insult except for Indians.

  30. phreak said, on September 22, 2007 at 6:01 am

    thank you gaurav, atleast you understand. but Mr.taunt, can we have our comments so we can taunt u

  31. Observer said, on September 22, 2007 at 2:31 pm


    on September 21st, 2007 on 3:20 pm

    a simple question and a conclusion

    Hanuman blew up in size to bring an entire mountain because he didn the exact herb on that mountain.

    then he flew to himalay from sri lanka and back.

    Question:

    couldnt he blow up in size and take ram and his army , so there would have been no need to build the setu at all

    Conclusion:

    the ramayan may be true , but not all that is wrtten is true. many things are exaggerated over the centuries.

    constructing the bandra worli seaface has taken more than 3 years. how can the setu have been built in 5 days?? this is something even retards will understand, but not some humans

    I believe we are at a stage where the population is transitioning between a state of knowing about what is possible and impossible in the real world, and a set of beliefs they had inherited at one time when things were not easily understood. I believe the above argumentative approach has value, but the approach is poor nonetheless. It provides an opening to other mud-slinging claims like why did Mary have to be a virgin, how can a man part 3 billion gallons of water with one hand assuming the gravitational acceleration was still 9.81 m/s^2 4000 years ago, did Mohammed use a particle beam to ascend from the Al-Aqsa mosque to heaven? Why did he not ask Allah to provide a space-plane to take a more comfortable journey? Where is heaven located, and why has the Hubble telescope not been able to find it? Why do we have mosques if Allah is everywhere?

    One cannot argue that rationalists have really produced astounding advances in science even 60 years after independence, or 80 years of “rationalist” paradise. It is a purely reactionary mechanism to justify ethno-linguistic identity. Such movements are necessarily bound to be hollow. The crux of the argument is that as a secular government, a government institution must apply the same principles to all matters of faith. I believe it is thins singling out of the the application of rationality to a particular religion, and not others which is leading to all this turmoil.

  32. realitycheck said, on September 22, 2007 at 4:05 pm

    >> The crux of the argument is that as a secular government, a government institution must apply the same principles to all matters of faith. >>

    Well said.

    In the west esp USA, it is okay to “think racist” but it is not okay to “act racist”.

    This is what is happening today in India.

    You can think “aryan invasion, ie racist”, but you cant act on it. This may sound like hyperbole, but in reality people of Tamilnadu are classified based on this theory, is it not ?

    There is a lot of churning happening due to increased nervousness about the various cases related to the political “magic wand”. Some media channels are going overboard in questioning the contempt laws.

    My prediction is that “contempt of court” will be the number one issue in the media in the next 3-6 months. Simply put, we have never tested what happens if an elected body asks the SC to take a hike. Trouble for the chief secretary ? Dismissal of government ? What if the government is friendly or critical to a coalition ? Sending in central forces ?

    Very sad state of affairs due to the uncontrolled brazenness of a few.

  33. Pranam said, on September 23, 2007 at 7:59 am

    reality check- your analysis does provide an alternate solution but I dont believe it can be implemented.

    It will be difficult for large vessels to navigate through a narrow Palk Strait route. Moreover the objective of saving time cannot be met as the speeds have to be considerably reduced.

    Also, I really dont see the economical benefit of having this canal. The ships do not gain a ‘significant’ amount of time. The area also has high LTTE activity. Ships wouldnt want to sail through an insecure route.

  34. realitycheck said, on September 23, 2007 at 8:21 am

    Pranam,

    It is 2.5 kms wide, we only need 300m for a canal. There are however ecological objections to going close to the mainland. The purpose of this post was to illustrate the geography of that region. Let experts figure out a solution. (How about running right though the Danushkodi causeway ?)

    Navigation is not going to be easy even with the proposed alignment 6. You need pilot boats or tug boats for the entire stretch.

    The LTTE should not be a factor in our national decision. It would be a very high risk route for them to take. There is not much evidence of TN ports of Chennai / Tuticorin helping the LTTE with logistics. Most of their shipping interests are eastbound (towards Burma, Thailand). The SL navy has a strong presence south of the proposed canal.

    I dont understand why S.Swamy is raising the LTTE issue. It just helps to build a negative sentiment among the Tamils (of SL).

  35. Adityan said, on September 23, 2007 at 1:24 pm

    With so many changes taking place in terms of balance of power in the world (China’s might, re-emergence of Russia…… etcetera), it would be very prudent to keep India’s security concerns topmost on the list. If Ram Sethu is blasted, we will be bound to allow international traffic to pass through just as in Panama Canal or Suez Canal. I am not a military expert, but it is worth considering the ramifications of opening these waters for international navigation.

  36. Observer said, on September 23, 2007 at 5:52 pm


    Also, I really dont see the economical benefit of having this canal. The ships do not gain a ’significant’ amount of time. The area also has high LTTE activity. Ships wouldnt want to sail through an insecure route.

    I think you are missing the point. Economical benefits are definitely there, namely the dredging companies who have committed money to DMK ministers bank accounts, a cut of which is taken by Karu as a tithe being the head law-breaker..errr….I mean the head lawmaker.

    Also, it would provide great cover for the LTTE to be able to smuggle arms and other goods amidst the increased traffic. It should be noted all the so-called Tamil “nationalist” parties who are aligned with the LTTE are in favor of this project. Now of course, this issue has assumed an air of Tamil identity versus Aryan/North Indian God identity. I wonder if the same Tamil parties would be so brazen if the bridge had instead been a “Murugan Sethu” bridge?

  37. Jai_Choorakkot said, on September 24, 2007 at 9:15 am

    What may be a useful guide:

    http://suvratk.blogspot.com/2007/09/ram-sethu-dummies-guide.html

    Informative. Covers only the science behind the issue, does not get into the politics. I am unaware of this blogger’s politics.

    found in the comment thread on the proses_anonymitus blog, placed by Krish. Thanks.

    regards,
    Jai

  38. pook said, on September 25, 2007 at 2:12 pm

    well. Ram sethu project will charge about 5000 us$ for a ship to pass through. if i were a shipping merchant, i prefer staying away from a such an expensive passage and go round lanka happily at lower cost to me. and i will also avoid nosy indian staff at the stuff i am carrying. and i will also stay away from LTTE pirates as much as possible. i would want to be caught in a cross fire between indian navy and the LTTE.
    ah ah ah ah . let Sonia baby enjoy the dolors pilfered from the project and dole out some few bucks to that old man in madras who likes to lick her boot.

  39. realitycheck said, on September 25, 2007 at 3:18 pm

    Jai,

    I read his article. His article is along the lines of what you would expect from a Geologist. Assuming his post is backed by field work, parts of his post would be one of the inputs to the project. Obviously, we cannot place much value on points 9, 10 (about Ramayan). Another input would be from marine biologists. However, the prime input is archeology.

    What ever the geology, it is still possible (the author admits) that there could have been some un-natural placement of rocks. Now, this can only be discoved by a full archeological expedition.

    I think all scientists are going to remain really silent on this one. There seems to have been no study of the area at all. This betrays a hidden agenda of the scientific community, to needle the religious feelings.

    This is soo freakishly unscientific. It is like observing a result without conducting an experiment.

  40. realitycheck said, on September 25, 2007 at 3:22 pm

    >> thread on the proses_anonymitus blog, placed by Krish >>

    Lol, did he try to get them to remove a link to my post ?

  41. phreak said, on September 25, 2007 at 5:48 pm

    i have been banned

  42. phreak said, on September 25, 2007 at 5:50 pm

    i am not able to post my reply

  43. shantanu said, on September 25, 2007 at 5:50 pm

    observer said

    “I believe it is this singling out of the the application of rationality to a particular religion, and not others which is leading to all this turmoil.”

    the context of the argument is ramayan, hence the particular example given by me. ofcourse the other examples given by you are hilarious. rationality does not apply to a particular religion, i was just talking in the context of the argument, i did not want to deviate from the context.

    mud slinging is what our politicians are displaying ( karunanidhi v/s vedanti). i nver indulged in mud slinging as you have suggested.i just pointed out a fictional description of an event described in the ramayan. i wont hesitate to comment on other religions , but the context should arise.

    then u said

    “One cannot argue that rationalists have really produced astounding advances in science even 60 years after independence, or 80 years of “rationalist” paradise. It is a purely reactionary mechanism to justify ethno-linguistic identity. Such movements are necessarily bound to be hollow.”

    please visit this link http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rationalist_movement

    now if you say albert einstein, voltaire, galeilio, charles darwin, benjamin franklin …… have not produced astounding advances in science , then maybe you consider the contributions of sadhus, mullas or priests as the basis of all science.

    what made you ask this question in the first place? infact, i ask you the same question, what have non rationalists contributed to science?

    and if you are talking of the rationalists of india, then it is obvious that the non rationalists are so many in number and the rationalists so few, that the contributions of rationalists are not so visible.
    see, we need more rationalist people, contrary to your argument.

    you said

    “he crux of the argument is that as a secular government, a government institution must apply the same principles to all matters of faith.”

    i agree with you on this sole issue. but the government has to think rationally for that, dont you agree?

  44. shantanu said, on September 25, 2007 at 5:51 pm

    i posted from a different username and id(i am phreak)

  45. Barbarindian said, on September 26, 2007 at 1:55 am

    Disappointed again. I visited the geologist link. It started with great fanfare. What a bummer. Well, tell us something we don’t know. Yeah, there are lots of rocks out there.

    What does science have to do with rationalism? Why does even the principle of rationality apply here?

    Remember that science believes in Darwin.

  46. Nag said, on September 26, 2007 at 12:47 pm

    Well, we have come a long way in terms of science and technology and have deduced many aspects with scientific and rational thinking.

    Can anyone tell me that we have the knowledge of everything that has happened, happening and would happen ?

    The Answer is no……..

    We should realise that Our knowledge is like a lamp in the forest….. whose light spreads only upto a certain boundary. We don’t know what is beyond. We don’t know what is hidden in the forest.

  47. Balaji said, on September 26, 2007 at 5:21 pm

    What nonsense dude? You give an alignment idea which has existed for a hundred years and claim credit for it? How can the Palk Strait be dredged so close to the Tamilnadu coast causing enormous damage to the coral reefs and the fishing communities?

    Your (no its not yours!) alignment will eliminate the Gulf of Mannar National Marine reserve completely. Get back to your senses dude. People who conceived the Setu Project aren’t that stupid.

  48. realitycheck said, on September 27, 2007 at 3:42 am

    Balaji,

    I dont claim credit for anything.

    Read the post completely till the last paragraph.It might do wonders for your comprehension skills.

  49. shantanu said, on September 28, 2007 at 2:24 pm

    i am waiting for your comments Mr.observer.

  50. harish said, on September 29, 2007 at 4:00 am

    Not Sure who the Author is……..

    A BRIDGE TOO FAR
    The Lord surveyed the Ram Setu and said “Hanuman, how diligently and strenuously you and your vanara sena had built this bridge several centuries back. It is remarkable that it has withstood the ravages of the climatic and geographical changes over centuries. It is indeed an amazing feat especially considering the fact that a bridge at Hyderabad built by Gammon using latest technology collapsed the other day even before they could stick the posters on its pillars.”
    Hanuman with all humility spoke “Jai Sri Ram, it is all because of your grace. We just scribbled your name on the bricks and threw them in the sea and they held. No steel from TISCO or cement from Ambuja or ACC was ever used. But Lord, why rake up the old issue now.”
    Ram spoke “Well, Hanuman some people down there want to demolish the bridge and construct a canal. The contract involves lot of money and lot of money will be made. They will make money on demolition and make more money on construction. ”
    Hanuman humbly bowed down and said “Why not we go down and present our case”
    Ram said “Times have changed since we were down there. They will ask us to submit age proof and we don’t have either a birth certificate or school leaving certificate. We traveled mainly on foot and some times in bullock carts and so we don’t have a driving license either. As far as the address proof is concerned the fact that I was born at Ayodhya is itself under litigation for over half a century, If I go in a traditional attire with bow and arrow, the ordinary folks may recognize me but Arjun Singh may take me to be some tribal and, at the most, offer a seat at IIT under the reserved category. Also, a God cannot walk in dressed in a three-piece suit and announce his arrival. It would make even the devotees suspicious. So it is dilemma so to say.”
    “I can vouch for you by saying that I personally built the bridge.”
    “My dear, Anjani putra, it will not work. They will ask you to produce the lay-out plan, the project details, including financial outlay and how the project cost was met and the completion certificate. Nothing is accepted without documentary evidence in India. You may cough but unless a doctor certifies it, you have no cough. A pensioner may present himself personally but the authorities do not take it as proof. He has to produce a life-certificate to prove that he is alive. It is that complicated.”
    “Lord can’t understand these historians. Over the years you have given darshan once every hundred years to saints like Surdas, Tulsidas, Saint Thyagaraja, Jayadeva, Bhadrachala Ramdas and even Sant Tukaram and still they disbelieve your existence and say Ramayana is a myth. The only option, I see, is to re-enact Ramayana on earth and set the government records straight once for all.”
    Lord smiled “It isn’t that easy today. Ravan is apprehensive that he may look like a saint in front of Karunanidhi. I also spoke to his mama Mareecha, who appeared as a golden deer to tempt Sita maiyya when I was in the forest and he said that he won’t take a chance of stepping on earth as long as Salman Khan is around.”

  51. shantanu said, on September 29, 2007 at 3:24 pm

    wow what a hilarious post.

    but i hope it was just a joke.

  52. [...] مدونة Reality check India عرضاً لأهم المعطيات حول راما سيتو و الشهادة الخطية [...]

  53. [...] Before we delve into a detailed analysis, I would suggest a reading of Ram Sethu for dummies. [...]

  54. Prashant said, on October 1, 2007 at 1:59 pm

    There is ramsetu which is true but it is todays need to create ram setu between india & shrilanka..so we support to indain govt to built ram setu..it is todays need to inmrove our contary

  55. markofando said, on October 2, 2007 at 3:07 am

    Want to start your private office arms race right now?

    I just got my own USB rocket launcher :-) Awsome thing.

    Plug into your computer and you got a remote controlled office missile launcher with 360 degrees horizontal and 45 degree vertival rotation with a range of more than 6 meters – which gives you a coverage of 113 square meters round your workplace.
    You can get the gadget here: http://tinyurl.com/2qul3c

    Check out the video they have on the page.

    Cheers

    Marko Fando

  56. Vinod said, on October 4, 2007 at 8:12 am

    As shown in the picture we can make way for the ships.We can build the Sethusamudram canal without touching the Ram Sethu via the Palk Strait route as shown in blue line.

  57. basavaraj artal said, on October 6, 2007 at 6:52 am

    This is very good inforrmation about Ram Sethu.

    As shown in the picture there is way for the ships.Sethusamudram canal can be built without touching the Ram Sethu via the Palk Strait route as shown in blue line.

    I don’t understand why the Govt is not willing to go from this route.

  58. realitycheck said, on October 6, 2007 at 8:40 am

    Basavaraj,

    That route may have ecological problems. There are other routes possible such as cutting through the causeway before the Sethu starts.

    If you are asking these questions, then this post has worked.. You now understand the geography of that region to ask such intelligent questions.

  59. Puratchi Thamizhan said, on October 19, 2007 at 1:25 pm

    hey guys,
    Stop your non sense discussions about sethu samuthram project.
    Never say ram sethu or nala sethu bridge it is just sethu samuthram shols
    Get down from himalayas see the thamizhans…
    We will construct sethu samudram canal project breakng the shoals…
    Shout whatever you want.

    If a single tamizhan gets goodness from it we will do it
    Since many number of tamizhans are going to get goodness we will contruct sedu canal in the specified path

    YOu guys have shouted for 80 yrs preventing the canal project completion

  60. yasaswi said, on October 21, 2007 at 9:12 pm

    cool, i like your thinking
    while this is still a hot topic
    i plan on writing an article about it
    and this has given me interesting arguments and good points
    cool

  61. bala said, on November 27, 2007 at 7:32 pm

    I strongly beleive that Lord Ram built this bridge..
    Beyond everything ..the govt is trying to break the canal with giant machines which are broken..so far 3 were broken and not able to do it..they are sunk into the sea now..stop breaking the divine bridge… It helps for the ships to less travel by only 2 hours..which is not the ideal reason to play with Hindu beleifs…
    Jai Sri Ram…

  62. [...] Confused published in Desipundit [8]) like that of The Great Bong [9], Jaafna [10], Parseval [11], Reality Check [12], Suvrat Kher [13] all of whom, using the results of the experiments conducted recently and [...]

  63. Amit said, on December 26, 2007 at 2:09 pm

    Sethusamudram, a project to create alternative shorter route for ships to cross the Gulf of Mannar, is a wonderful idea — one which is more than 150 years old. The channel, originally an idea of a British commander named A D Taylor was put forth in 1860. In 1955, the Government of India set up the Sethusamudram project committee to look into the feasibility of the project and five routes were discussed till 2001 but nothing happened. The National Democratic Alliance government sanctioned a few crore rupees to study the project but before a final decision on the route could be taken, the government lost power.

    That is the memory so beautifully adopted by the Geological Survey of India in its logo, which describes India in this line etched at the bottom of its insignia — Aasetu Himachal, meaning India is spread between the Bridge and the Himalayas. That is the Ram Setu Bridge on the southern tip of our motherland, an identity of the nation, under destruction now.

    Now when the media and political leaders are busy with the Uttar Pradesh election and exit polls, the Sethusamudram dredgers are busy destroying a great world heritage site India has.

    contact-us;—amitprem_delhi@yahoo.com

    Amit:————————————————-JAI SRI RAM

  64. [...] Confused published in Desipundit [8]) like that of The Great Bong [9], Jaafna [10], Parseval [11], Reality Check [12], Suvrat Kher [13] all of whom, using the results of the experiments conducted recently and [...]

  65. Rajeev Sharma said, on April 16, 2008 at 4:44 am

    This is really a good approach to make people aware. As most of Hindu never know about this real evidence of Baghvan Rama existence. So far Ram Setu was a mythical identity. Really appreciate you to make it alive for Hindu community.

    JAI SHRI RAM

  66. [...] Confused published in Desipundit [8]) like that of The Great Bong [9], Jaafna [10], Parseval [11], Reality Check [12], Suvrat Kher [13] all of whom, using the results of the experiments conducted recently and [...]

  67. [...] 3. Ram sethu for Dummies [...]

  68. Naren said, on August 14, 2008 at 11:35 am

    My question is what all these BJP leaders were doing when Vajpaie government approved this route and plan. Realy if they are concerned of Ram bridge why any objection were not raised when there were sitting as decision makers.

    It’s all political gimmicks as Babar masjid which was forgotten completely during their rule and till now.

    Now election in nearing , we can hear Babri masji , Ram sethu bridge …etc. from this BJP leaders .

  69. [...] Confused published in Desipundit [8]) like that of The Great Bong [9], Jaafna [10], Parseval [11], Reality Check [12], Suvrat Kher [13] all of whom, using the results of the experiments conducted recently and [...]

  70. longhinos said, on September 16, 2008 at 3:56 pm

    Where is Palk Strait and Manar strait?

  71. [...] Confused published in Desipundit [8]) like that of The Great Bong [9], Jaafna [10], Parseval [11], Reality Check [12], Suvrat Kher [13] all of whom, using the results of the experiments conducted recently and [...]

  72. Liberal Observer said, on September 28, 2009 at 1:46 am

    Nice Post for dummies on Rama-Sethu. Being a liberal observer, I dont understand why you get bashed from my kin. It doesn’t matter whether you are religious (or not), Hindu (or Not) a believer (or not). We stand to loose every bit by demolishing RamaSethu.
    Destroy Rama Sethu and you loose
    1. Coral Reef Biolife
    2. Protection of West/Southern Coast from Eastern Tsunamis (and Vice Versa, by definition)
    3. Protection of Mineral Wealth along Coastal land.
    4. Protection of India as a whole.

    What’s to prevent another 12/26 Mumbai Style attack using our own constructed channel on Rama Sethu.

  73. Liberal Observer said, on September 28, 2009 at 2:02 am

    And may I also suggest a book on Rama Sethu by Dr Subramanian Swamy. It retails for less than 10 bucks. The book has an excellent coverage of historical, economical, ecological views on Rama Sethu. If Dr Swamy’s numbers are right, the politicians behind this are taking Indians (aam Admi) for a ride.

  74. Horacio F. Arganis-Juarez said, on July 16, 2010 at 12:51 am

    Lord Rama: Fact or Fiction
    By Stephen Knapp

    As of late, in the year 2007, the idea of whether Lord Rama exists or not has been called into question, by no less than some of the politicians in India. So it is a wonder how such persons can be accepted as leaders of the people of India who should be concerned with preserving and protecting the culture of the country. Obviously, they are neither concerned nor aware of the depths of information that can be found in support of the traditions for which India is especially known. Or, they are really attempting to dismantle or destroy the authority of the timeless nature of the civilization of the country.

    In regard to Lord Rama, the point about ancient history is that the farther you go back in time, the fewer references you can use that actually refer to the incident in history. There may be many commentaries, but few quotations to the actual events.

    However, when it comes to the Ramayana and the history of Lord Rama, there have been numerous authors who have accepted the Ramayana as a history of ancient events. For example, the first Governor General of India, Sri Rajaji, wrote on the Ramayana and called it a history, as also did the English Indologist Sir William Jones. Various other western authors have made a study of the culture and history of the Ramayana, such as Philip Lutgendorf in his book Rama’s Story in Shiva’s City, California University; Joe Burkhalter Flueckiger and Laurie Sears in The Boundaries of Traditional Ramayana and Mahabharata Performances in South and Southeast Asia, University of Michigan, Ann Arbor; W. L. Smith on Ramayan Traditions in Eastern India, University of Stockholm, and others.

    There are also numerous places that are indicated as the locations where various events happened in reference to the pastimes of Lord Rama and Sita. Thus, they are accepted as historical sites. I have personally visited many of these places, such as Ramesvaram, Nasik, Hampi, and others where there are particular locations and sites that are related to the events that took place in the life and adventures of Lord Rama. Many people accept these sites as the locations for the events described in the Ramayana. So how can this be unless there are not some reality behind it?

    However, why is there not more archaeological evidence that points towards Rama’s existence? Because such an effort has not been made in India and systematic excavations have never been carried out, says historian Nandita Krishnan. She says that to doubt the existence of Rama is to doubt all literature. There is little archaeological or epigraphic evidence for either Jesus Christ or Prophet Mohammed, who are known only from the Bible and Koran respectively. Does it mean they did not exist? If Rama performs miracles such as liberating Ahalya, the Biblical story of Jesus walking on water or the Koranic tale of Mohammed flying to heaven on a horse are equally miraculous. Such stories reinforce divinity.

    She also describes in summary what areas the events of Lord Rama’s life took place. She explains: “The Ramayana is geographically very correct. Every site on Rama’s route is still identifiable and has continuing traditions or temples to commemorate Rama’s visit. Around 1000 BC or earlier, no writer had the means to travel around the country inventing a story, fitting it into local folklore and building temples for greater credibility.

    “In 1975 the Archaeological Survey of India (ASI) unearthed fourteen pillar bases of kasauti stone with Hindu motifs near the mosque at Ayodhya; reports of the excavations are available with the ASI. Rama was born in Ayodhya and married in Mithila, now in Nepal. Not far from Mithila is Sitamarhi, where Sita was found in a furrow, still revered as the Janaki kund constructed by her father Janaka. Rama and Sita left Mithila for Ayodhya via Lumbini. In 249 BC, Ashoka erected a pillar in Lumbini with an inscription referring to the visits by both Rama and Buddha to Lumbini. Ashoka was much nearer in time to Rama and would be well aware of his facts.

    “Rama, Lakshmana and Sita left Ayodhya and went to Sringaverapura – modern Sringverpur in Uttar Pradesh – where they crossed the River Ganga. They lived on Chitrakoot hill where Bharata and Shatrughna met them and the brothers performed the last rites for their father. Thereafter, the three wandered through Dandakaranya in Central India, described as a land of Rakshasas, obviously tribes inimical to the brothers’ habitation of their land. Tribals are still found in these forests. The trio reached Nasik, on the River Godavari, which throbs with sites and events of Rama’s sojourn, such as Tapovan where they lived, Ramkund where Rama and Sita used to bathe, Lakshmankund, Lakshmana’s bathing area, and several caves in the area associated with their lives in the forest.

    “Rama then moved to Panchavati near Bhadrachalam (AP), where Ravana abducted Sita. The dying Jatayu told them of the abduction, so they left in search of Sita. Kishkinda, near Hampi, where Rama first met Sugriva and Hanuman, is a major Ramayana site, where every rock and river is associated with Rama. Anjanadri, near Hospet, was the birthplace of Hanuman (Anjaneya); Sugriva lived in Rishyamukha on the banks of the Pampa (Tungabhadra); Sabari probably also lived in a hermitage there. Rama and the Vanara army left Kishkinda to reach Rameshwaram, where the Vanaras built a bridge to Lanka from Dhanushkodi on Rameshwaram Island to Talaimannar in Sri Lanka. While parts of the bridge – known as Adam’s Bridge – are still visible, NASA’s satellite has photographed an underwater man-made bridge of shoals in the Palk Straits, connecting Dhanushkodi and Talaimannar. On his return from Sri Lanka, Rama worshiped Shiva at Rameshwaram, where Sita prepared a Linga out of sand. It is still one of the most sacred sites of Hinduism.

    “Sri Lanka also has relics of the Ramayana. There are several caves, such as Ravana Ella Falls, where Ravana is believed to have hidden Sita to prevent Rama from finding her. The Sitai Amman Temple at Numara Eliya is situated near the ashokavana where Ravana once kept her prisoner.”

    In describing the places in Sri Lanka that are associated with Lord Rama and the Ramayana, “Sri Lankan folklore and religious scholars have identified more than 30 places on the island which are associated with the Ramayana. And interestingly enough, people in these places have a strong sense of history and lore, and a strong sense of possession. They are proud of their association with the Hindu epic,” explained S. Kalaiselvan, director general Sri Lanka Tourism Development Authority. This is the case, even though 90 percent of the people in the Ramayana-related areas are Sinhalese Buddhists.

    According to the Ramayana, Ravana brought Sita to Sri Lanka by a vehicle called ‘Pushpaka Vimanam’ by the Hindus and ‘Dandu Monara Yanthraya’ by the
    Sinhalese Buddhists. According to mythology, this vehicle landed at Werangatota, about 10 km from Mahiyangana, east of the hill station of Nuwara Eliya, in central Sri Lanka. Sita was then taken to Goorulupota, now known as Sitakotuwa, where Ravana’s wife, Mandodari, lived. Seetakotuwa is about 10 km from Mahiyangana on the road to Kandy. Sita was housed in a cave at Sita Eliya, on the Colombo-Nuwara Eliya road. There is a temple for her there. She is believed to have bathed in the mountain stream flowing beside the temple.

    North of Nuwara Eliya, in Matale district, is Yudhaganapitiya, where the Rama-Ravana battle took place. According to a Sinhalese legend, Dunuwila is the place from where Rama shot the ‘Bramshira’ arrow that killed Ravana. The Sri Lankan king was chalking out his battle plans in a place called Lakgala when the killer arrow struck him. Lakgala is a rock from the top of which Ravana could see north Sri Lanka clearly. It served as a watchtower following the expectation that Rama would invade the island to rescue his consort. Ravana’s body was placed on the rock at Yahangala for his subjects to pay their last respects. Since Ravana was a Brahmin, it was considered a sin to kill him, even in battle. To wash off the sin, Rama performed puja at the Munneswaram temple in Chilaw, 80 km north of Colombo. At Manaweri, north of Chilaw, there is a temple gifted by Rama.

    According to another legend from the southern part of Sri Lanka, Sita was actually detained in the mountainous forest area of Rumassala near Galle. When she fell ill, Hanuman wanted to bring some medicinal plants from the Dronagiri mountain in the Himalayan chain to cure her. Since he could not find the plants, he brought the whole mountain and dropped it at Unawatuna, which is near the present Galle harbour. Unawatuna means ‘here it fell’. Indeed, the area is known for its medicinal plants.

    At Ramboda, in the central highlands, known for its massive waterfalls, a temple for Hanuman has now sprung up as the belief is that he had visited Sita who was incarcerated there. Legend has it that the Koneswaram temple, in the eastern district of Trincomalee, was gifted by Lord Shiva to Ravana, as he was an ardent devotee. In the famous Buddha Vihara at Kelani, near Colombo, there is a representation of Rama handing over captured Sri Lanka to Ravana’s brother, Vibheeshana, who sided with him in his conflict with Ravana.

    Nandita Krishnan continues to explain the importance of these holy sites, “All the places visited by Rama still retain memories of his visit, as if it happened yesterday. Time, in India, is relative. Some places have commemorative temples; others commemorate the visit in local folklore. But all agree that Rama was going from or to Ayodhya. Why doubt connections when literature, archaeology and local tradition meet? Why doubt the connection between Adam’s Bridge and Rama, when nobody else in Indian history has claimed its construction? Why doubt that Rama traveled through Dandakaranya or Kishkinda, where local non-Vedic tribes still narrate tales of Rama? Why doubt that he was born in and ruled over Ayodhya?

    “Rama’s memory lives on because of his extraordinary life and his reign, which was obviously a period of great peace and prosperity, making Ramarajya a reference point. People only remember the very good or the very bad. Leftist historians have chosen to rubbish archaeology, literature and local tradition.”

    Nandita Krishnan also adds that “Nobody believed that Homer’s Iliad was a true story till Troy was discovered after extensive archaeology. Unfortunately, the sites of the Ramayana and Mahabharata have now been built over many times and it may never be possible to excavate extensively either at Ayodhya or Mathura.”

    To further verify this aspect of the history of Lord Rama, Pushkar Bhatnagar concludes that geographical evidence for the epics is abundant. There still exist many places like Rameshwaram, Kishkindha, Kurukshetra, Hastinapura, etc. where the visits of Rama and Krishna are a basic part of local folklore.

    Lack of archaeological evidence is no excuse for denying the existence of history, sums up Bhatnagar. “If the buildings of that time over 7000 years ago do not exist today, can we just infer that civilizations and personalities of that time also did not exist?”

    In literature, we have the Ramayana and other texts such as the Puranas which also relate and verify the history and existence of Lord Rama. People from many other regions of the world have also accepted the Ramayana as worthy of attention, devotion, and historical evidence. For example, we can see the affects of the Ramayana tradition in many countries who have adapted their own form of the Ramayana and worship of Lord Rama, especially in the countries of Southeast Asia. These include Burma (Myanmar), Cambodia (Capuchia), Thailand, Indonesia, Malaysia, the Philippines and Vietnam. Other areas can also be found where the influence of the history of Lord Rama is in affect, such as the continent of Africa was once known as Kushadvipa for having been ruled by Kush, one of Lord Rama’s sons.

    The other fact is that many millions of people feel the reciprocation from Lord Rama whenever they engage in devotion to Him, or read the Ramayana, or hear the Ramayana in a katha, or watch a television show or movie about Him, or go to one of the temples dedicated to Him. This cannot be denied or neglected. Just because we have insensitive politicians who cannot perceive this reciprocation does not mean that we all are so spiritually undeveloped. This dedication and reciprocation has spread throughout the world.

    There have also been astronomers who have identified the approximate time of the Ramayana by the descriptions of the stars and constellations as given in the Ramayana, or even in the Bhagavata Purana and other texts. Pushkar Bhatnagar, author of the book Dating the Era of Lord Rama, claims that there is a significant amount of information available to prove that Rama was a historical personality. He says, “Valmiki, who wrote the Ramayana, was a contemporary of Rama. While narrating the events of the epic, he has mentioned the position of the planets at several places.” He explains that by using recent planetary software, it has been possible to verify that these planetary positions actually took place precisely as specified in the Ramayana. These were not just stray events, but the entire sequence of the planetary positions as described by Valmiki at various stages of Rama’s life can be verified today as having taken place.

    Bhatnagar goes on to explain: “This information is significant, since these configurations do not repeat for lakhs of years and cannot be manipulated or imagined so accurately, without the help of sophisticated software. The inference that one can draw is that someone was present there to witness the actual happening of these configurations, which got recorded in the story of Rama.”

    Bhatnagar provides the following quote from the Ramayana: “Rama was born on the Navami tithi of Shukla Paksha of Chaitra masa (9th day of the increasing phase of the moon in the lunar month of Chaitra). At that time, the nakshatra was Punarvasu, and Sun, Mars, Saturn, Jupiter and Venus were in Aries, Capricorn, Libra, Cancer and Pisces respectively. Lagna was Cancer and Jupiter & Moon were shining together. — Ramayana 1.18.8,9

    The conditions can be summarized as follows, according to Bhatnagar:
    1. Sun in Aries
    2. Saturn in Libra
    3. Jupiter in Cancer
    4. Venus in Pisces
    5. Mars in Capricorn
    6. Lunar month of Chaitra
    7. 9th day after New Moon (Navami Tithi, Shukla Paksh)
    8. Moon near Punarvasu Nakshatra (Pollux star in Gemini constellation)
    9. Cancer as Lagna (Cancer constellation rising in the east)
    10. Jupiter above the horizon

    According to the Planetarium software, it provides the following date: Sri Rama Navami – 10th January 5114 BCE – Birth Day of Rama, Observation at 12.30 p.m.

    Bhatnagar continues: “By using a powerful planetarium software, I found that the planetary positions mentioned in Ramayana for the date of birth of Lord Ram had occurred in the sky at around 12.30 p.m. of 10th January 5114 BC. It was the ninth day of the Shukla Paksh of Chaitra month too. Moving forward, after 25 years of the birth of Lord Ram, the position of planets in the sky tallies with their description in Ramayana. Again, on the amavasya (new moon) of the 10th month of the 13th year of exile the solar eclipse had indeed occurred and the particular arrangement of planets in the sky was visible. ( Date comes to 7th October, 5077 BC). Even the occurrence of subsequent two eclipses also tally with the respective description in Valmiki Ramayana. (Date of Hanuman’s meeting Sita at Lanka was 12th September, 5076 BC). In this manner the entire sequence of the planetary positions gets verified and all the dates can be precisely determined.”

    Although this provides verification of the existence for Lord Rama according to calculations as given in the Ramayana, some people feel the timing for the day and year of His birth may be different than what the planetarium software indicates. For example, Vedic astrologer Nartaka Gopala devi dasi points out that “Regarding the calculation of Lord Rama’s birth as 10th of January 5114 BCE – Birth Day of Rama, Observation at 12.30 PM, there are 2 reasons why this cannot be correct. His rising sign, or lagna, is Cancer. That places Aries in the tenth house, and He has the Sun in Aries. The placement of the Sun in any birth chart will tell the time of day of the birth. Sun in the tenth house means birth at noontime (approx. 11 AM to 2 PM). There are no exceptions to this. (Lord Krishna appeared at midnight, the Sun is in Leo, 4th house for Taurus rising. Birth at 6 PM means 7th house Sun. Birth at sunrise means 1st house Sun.) Also, in Lord Rama’s chart the Sun is in Aries, and the dates for Sun in Aries are fixed, which means the same each year on April 14th to May 13th. So how did the January 10 date come up? These two Jyotish corrections are common sense that any Vedic astrologer would immediately see.” So there may be a difference in what the planetarium software suggests. This also corroborates why we who follow the Vedic calendar celebrate Lord Rama’s appearance in April-May each year. So the traditional date appears accurate.

    Furthermore, some people feel that the appearance of Lord Rama took place many thousands or even millions of years earlier, in the Treta-yuga. For example, the Bhagavata Purana clearly states that Lord Rama became king during Treta yuga (Bhag. 9.10.51). We have been in Kali-yuga for 5000 years. Before this was Dvapara-yuga which lasts 864,000 years. Before that was Treta-yuga, which lasts over 1,200,000 years. Thus, according to this, the existence of Lord Rama had to have been many thousands of years ago. And if Lord Rama appeared in one of the previous Treta-yugas, it would certainly indicate that Lord Rama appeared several million years ago. And this is exactly what is corroborated in the Vayu Purana.

    In the Vayu Purana (70.47-48) [published by Motilal Banarsidass] there is a description of the length of Ravana’s life. It explains that when Ravana’s merit of penance began to decline, he met Lord Rama, the son of Dasarath, in a battle wherein Ravana and his followers were killed in the 24th Treta-yuga. The Roman transliteration of the verse is:

    tretayuge chaturvinshe ravanastapasah kshayat
    ramam dasharathim prapya saganah kshayamiyavan

    The same Ramayana that gives the planetary descriptions (on which the above calculation is based) also tells that Lord Rama came in Treta-yuga. The Matsya Purana (47/240,243-246) is another source that also gives more detail of various avataras and says Bhagawan Rama appeared at the end of the 24th Treta-yuga.

    There are 1000 Treta-yugas in one day of Brahma, and it is calculated that we are presently in the 28th cycle of the four yugas (called divya-yugas, which is a cycle of the four yugas, Satya-yuga, Treta-yuga, Dvapara-yuga, and then Kali-yuga) of Vaivasvata Manu, who is the seventh Manu in the series of 14 Manu rulers who exist in one kalpa or day of Brahma. Each Manu is considered to live for 71 such divya-yuga cycles. So, without getting too complicated about things, from the 24th Treta-yuga to the present age of this 28th cycle of Kali-yuga, there is obviously a difference of millions of years when Lord Rama manifested here on earth. This gives the period of Lord Rama approximately 18 million years ago. Furthermore, the planetary positions mentioned in the Ramayana would also have occurred multiple times in history prior to the calculated date. Of course, few people may believe this unless they are already familiar with the vast lengths of time that the Vedic literature deals with.

    Nonetheless, maybe there is further reason why we should accept that Lord Rama appeared millions of years ago. In the Valmiki Ramayana, Sundara-Kanda (or Book 5), Chapter 4, verse 27, [Gita Press, Gorakhpur, India] it explains that when Hanuman first approached Ravana’s palace, he saw the doorways surrounded by horses and chariots, palanquins and aerial cars, beautiful horses and elephants, nay, with four-tusked elephants decked with jewels resembling masses of white clouds.

    Elsewhere in the Valmiki Ramayana, Sundara-Kanda (or Book 5), Chapter 27, verses12, an ogress named Trijata has a dream of Lord Rama, which she describes to the other demoniac ogresses upon awakening. In that dream she sees Rama, scion of Raghu, united again with Sita. Sri Rama was mounted on a huge elephant, closely resembling a hill, with four tusks.

    The question is how could there be a mention of the elephants with four tusks unless Valmiki and the people of his era were familiar with such creatures? A quick search on the Encarta Encyclopedia will let us know that these four-tusked elephants were known as Mastodontoidea, which are said to have evolved around 38 million years ago and became extinct about 15 million years ago when the shaggy and two tusked Mastodons increased in population. Now there’s something to think about, eh? So this would mean that the specific planetary configuration that is described in the Ramayana, and is verified by Pushkar Bhatnagar, may have indeed happened, but at a time millions of years prior to merely 10,000 years ago.

    In this way, as we go through the evidence, we can see how Lord Rama was an actual historic personality, as described in the Ramayana and in other Puranic texts. Nonetheless, there will always be those for whom no matter what you present for verification, it will not be enough. Some just won’t believe it. Some will, some won’t, so what, let’s move on. But many in the world already accept the authority of the Ramayana and other Vedic texts for the verification of the existence of Lord Rama.

    Jaya Sri Rama!

    You can also read the summarized version of the Ramayana as found here on my website.

    [Available at: http://www.stephen-knapp.com


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